This car could be seized
http://tougeking.blogspot.com/
Ontario’s new anti-racing legislation, which allows police to impound vehicles for racing infractions, has stirred some controvery, and now an online petition is calling for changes.
The petition was set up by Tim Chisholm, who says in the document that a seven-day vehicle seizure and driver’s licence suspension penalty imposed by the street-racing legislation “continues to punish thousands of citizens who were not convicted” of racing.
Nearly 5,000 people have been charged under the law, says Chisholm.
He says the law contravenes the Charter of Rights and Freedoms, and should be changed. About 900 people have signed so far. See the petition at www.petitiononline.com.
Those who blame speed as a cause of an accident are wrong and brainwashed by propaganda.
The cause of an accident is caused by stupidity of careless drivers, doesn’t matter how fast they drive, who are lousy with low driving skills or assholes who doesn’t want to share the road.
Most of the time it’s improper lane changing and cutting off another driver or not paying enough attention to traffick on a road or poor weather conditions or technical vehicle problems like for example cheap tires.
I have no patience for driver negligence either Cindy. You seem to make a lot of assumptions such as assuming I was riding bumpers when I was not. You are assuming that because I exceed the speed limit I am negligent about it. I don’t support people turing the city streets into a scene from the Fast and Furious either Cindy. But I don’t agree that pushing a speed limit on an open road is negligent either. I slow down when nearing a pack of cars on the highway to minimise speed differential, and when I pass that pack(with minimum speed differential)I speed up again.
Rob, I came here because you called my advocacy “silly”.
I am not against speeding but I have no patience for negligence or driver inattentiveness. It doesn’t matter if it’s rush hour, I don’t ride bumpers. I leave stopping distance. It’s part of my training. It’s ingrained in my psyche. I drive courtesy of everyone. The road is not my personal playground.
I saw what you wrote on my site through my web log trackings.
Your posts are also appearing on my site so if you want to continue this negligent advice or critique of other drivers, come on over to the Creed
Oh and in response to your “Pack of 3. Glad to know you maintain a safe distance.” remark. Yes Cindy. On a highway as on any road, every once in a while, you do come up to other cars. No the other two cars were not friends on mine driving in a convoy with me and I didn’t know them. If you can manage to drive with absolutely nobody around you at all times please post how it is you pull it off.
And thank you for providing a prime example on how you miss the point. Who drives blindly around a bend? It’s a highway Cindy. It has bends in it. Ever been on one? Our eyes were open thank you.A deer can jump out anywhere and regardless of the speed limit. So are we all supposed to idle our cars around highway bends just in case there is a deer, a person, a stalled car? The point here is that slower is not always safer. Again I will have to reitterate, that the argument is more on how the stunt driving law is written.
And I quote Rob:
[i]we came around a bend and almost all smashed right into the back of some fool doing I would guess about 20 under the limit.[/i]
Thank you, Rob, for providing a prime example why speed limits exist. It’s obvious you are not psychic or else you would have known there was a car around a bend driving slower than you.
Who the hell drives blindly around a bend anyway? Especially at the limit or higher? What if there was a deer just standing there or a stalled car? What kind of reaction time would you have?
Pack of 3. Glad to know you maintain a safe distance.
I remember once while on a highway in a pack of 3 other cars, (to all you anti-speeders we were all doing at most 10 over the limit so don’t get excited), we came around a bend and almost all smashed right into the back of some fool doing I would guess about 20 under the limit. We all had to come onto the brakes hard and take evasive action to avoid hitting this joker. BUT, he was going very very slow and therefore was being oh so much safer than all of us who were pretty much at the speed limit right!?
I find that most of these anti-speeders are typically people who have no confidence in their driving ability and rightfully so because they really have little to none. You see them all the time with the two hand death grip on the steering wheel and their nose and inch away from the windshield looking like they’re gonna drop a loaf in their pants at any minute. People tend to judge others abilities using their own as a reference so when ones abilities are seriously lacking, they think that everyone who is going faster than them is just a reckless maniac.
sorry wrong link posted above…lol… here’s the one you want
http://www.motorists.org/speedlimits/
oh and here’s one more for you idiots who think that speeding is sooooo dangerous.
http://cmgonline.com/content/view/548/51/
read that and let me know what you think. It’s american but is still relevant. I don’t mind someone who is speeding and i don’t mind those who want to do a average speed of 20 over but idiots who will do the speed limit or under really are out of touch with reality. even my friends who are cops say they wish they could give tickets to these people cause they are the real danger on the road. speeding is NOT DANGEROUS if done in a reasonable non aggresive way.
and if you don’t believe me about driver training here’s one of many articles that prove this fact.
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/toronto/story/2008/04/17/ont-drivers.html
Driver training definitly does not make drivers better. I didn’t really speed the first 2 years after getting my licence cause i didn’t feel 100% comfortable doing it. Now i will average 20 – 30 km over most of the time, cause i feel comfortable. I am safer than most drivers on the road even those who do not speed. I never took driver traing. My BMW will stop better at 150 than your toyota or pontiac will at 100. Thats part of the reason i got it. Faster and safer. I don’t think you should speed excessivly if you do not a car designed to. Allthough i wouldn’t consider 30 over to be excessive.
I think it’s sad and pathetic how many people are missing the point. This is just another government knee jerk reaction and cash grab. If they really wanted safer roads they would put more effort into driver training. The fact is THIS LAW IS DECLARING PEOPLE GUILTY BEFORE BEING PROVEN GUILTY IN A COURT OF LAW and that is setting a VERY damgerous precedent. Nobody is disputing the fact that dangerous drivers should be punished even though a few ignorant people here would like to make it seem so. Radar guns and cops are far from perfect and the number of reduced charges are proving that.
Police officers are not perfect. Some will shoot the laser on off axis angles through glass not knowing that the refractive index of glass at 1.51xxx say at 39 degrees will refract at 74 degrees away from target. Being falsely convicted of a life altering offence can change a person. Laser guns specs from the Manufacturer state that the devices are accurate within a number of km/per hour IF used properly. At 151 km per hour a car is travelling 138 ft per second. Can a policeman sitting in his car in a compromised position make a mistake?? Actually they can make several mistakes.
My hope, Mr. Speed Demon, is that you take yourself out before you take out someone more conciderate.
Keep it on the track.
🙁 fuk you all………..ill speed if i want to licence or not..quit yer whining fukin pussys…..suspended but not stopped i got more than 1 car losers,,,,move over or bite the rail bitches…mabey maguinty should stop sukin fantino cock…hahaha
Why not make the law for 1 Km over the limit. It seems the majority agree we should not be speeding!
Hopefully common sense tells us all that there really is no safe place on public roads to be 50 Km over but I’m all for a having your day in court before getting the punishment.
What did I learn? I learned that life is not fair. I learned not to give up a risky activity that I love (motorcycling), because I could die accidentily from any mundane activity or health problem.
It always comes back to the same thing. Poor skills and/or poor judgement kill. Could you honestly say that if every vehicle on the road were limited to 100 kph, deaths due to crashes would be significantly reduced? I would say that the same innattentive, drunk or inexperienced drivers would still be killing themselves and others.
Well Norm, what did you learn from your mother’s death. Did you think that maybe you should go brush up on your driving skills or petition the government to make driver training mandatory? Nope.
Instead, there are people petitioning for higher speed limits but not for the training required or needed to drive them. My mom taught me how to drive and as a result taught me all her bad habits too. Sad but true. Eventually I did take driving lessons with a school when my son went so I could make an example and I didn’t want to teach him. Most people are taught by a parent, sibling or friend.
Since we’re on the topic, how many of you in here spend the $419 and take a driver’s refresher course, specifically the “collision-free’course offered through Young Drivers of Canada?
Ya, that’s what I thought because of the 3 times I’ve gone in the past 13 years, the course is never full & most people who are there are there because their insurance agent suggested it and because their premiums are ridiculous. I have a 9-star insurance rating and consider myself to be a skilled driver because I have papers that certify me to be one. Why do I do this? So I don’t kill someone’s mom due to error.
Speed doesn’t kill?
Driving is a skill and sadly, many of us – including you and me – benefit greatly from driving training and refresher courses (like I do under the Young Drivers of Canada program because as we age, we tend to pick up bad habits along the way). I didn’t wait for the government or you to tell me to do this training, I do it on my own. I think mandatory testing should be done every 10 years and if it was implemented and had been done, your mother will still be with you.
I have documented every case this year where speed has killed, even experienced drivers can kill with speed.
Hey Gigababy,
What will you say after I tell you my mother WAS killed by a car driver? While she walked on the sidewalk in the city. The driver (likely with low insurance rates ‘cause he was 50+) was trying to turn into a parking lot, nailed the gas instead of the brake, and drove 50’ down the sidewalk, running over my mother in the process.
Speed doesn’t kill. Poor skills and poor judgment do.
Yea I thought so. Sorry, sucks to be me.
Legitimate petitions that aren’t a waste of time to the general public such as this one are not acceptable to any Leglistative Assembly in any province of Canada. If Mr. Chisholm had done his due diligence he would realize that petitions much contain the full mailing address of the person who signs it and a signature.
I also saw this in the Toronto Star as a letter and as surprised the Star ran it considering it’s invalid and would never been accepted by any MPP.
this is how i see it
you take a driving test,written first then road tested.
if you pass them you are qualified for a licence.
you are given a licence with the full knowledge of the rules & laws.break the rules & laws and you become diqualified.nowhere does it say you have the right to drive but you do have the right to drive safely, not dangerously or recklessly and our hiways are not the autobahn,you will have to go to germany for that.
i think they should have everyone that wants to drive sign a form giving up licence & cars should you drive over 50.tired of hearing all of you :cry
What people like ‘HEART’ fail to regonize:
1) The fact that all the politicians in the world thought something was a good idea, doesn’t make it so. This was sold as a law against racing. Apparently most of the people involved read 1984, as they’ve NewSpeaked the word quite effectively.
2) Passing a bill into law doesn’t guarantee that it will survive a Constitutional challenge. We are supposed to be presumed innocent until proved guilty, in a court of law. Please don’t raise the hackneyed comments about impaired operation.
The 400 highways, excluding 407, were built for a top cruising speed of 70 miles per hour, about 112 kph. Many divided highways in NS and Nb have a 110 kph limit.
The much loved Auto Bahn has a speed limit, yes, but only in built up parts of the country. They are considering new blanket one due to emissions though.
So, to you, supporters of this law. You get accused of shop lifting at Wal Mart, made to pay back the cost of what you allegedly stole and spend the weekend in a cell. Monday, the video exonerates you, was someone very similer looking to you.
Exact same G@D D@MN difference
Check this link, it explains it all!!!!!!!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cVrOAw4xGs4
has any1 been found innocent yet of the charge?
cases have come to court, i know because i was 1 of them. new car, was testing its legs. got pulled over on dvp didn’t seem like i was really going 141 but the car handled great, new audi a4. but it was 90 where i was caught. cost me 760 to get my car out. had to take the bus to work. pain in the ass. i still got court and plea. but the law is what it is, u drive 50 over & the speed was recorded digitally with a laser, hard to argue but it is what it is and i cant say i didnt know what i was doing. it justsucked large.
Raj should read the legislation and highway traffic act as well as the petition. It isn’t the penalty for violation of the legislation that is the concern. The primary objection is the imposition of the license suspension and vehicle impoundment before appearing in court. If the person charged is found innocent in court the cost of vehicle impoundment and the license suspension still stand and will not be cleared from the record.
[url=http://gigababy.blogspot.com/2008/05/so-much-for-quiet-night-on-streets.html]Safest roads in Ontario[/url], huh?
Whatever. I hope no speeds into you and puts you in the hospital for 45 days.
i’m glad u can afford the gas for speeding. there r limits on the autobahn, its 130 which is what every1 does on the 407 anyway and on the 401 after 8pm so y bitch when u already have it?
at 160 the 401 is dangerous with no median or grass areas to drive ur car onto to avoid another car that may have trouble. if u do 100-110, u stop better. if u do 140, u up the ks of force. simple physics. speed limits r designed for ur safety. u get it? u want all these bad drivers doin’ 140-160 with u when many cant handle 120? yikes. also, shouldnt the petition ask for address/email/tel# to be legit?
Oh, one more thing, Throttle. Are you psychic?
Do you really know what’s going on 1 to 2 kms up the supposed, deserted road while you are doing 160? You know? Disabled car, truck, dead animal, debris, etc? Oh my bad, like ALL Ontario drivers you must be a licensed Nascar driver trained to drive at race track speeds on PUBLIC, TAXPAYER funded roads so you can predict every damn thing your car can do. Realty is 90% of drivers aren’t trained that way. And if you crash and put yourself in the hospital you also cost taxpayers 7Gs a day to make you feel better. I’m glad I bug you. Slow down.
The Autobahn is a monitored highway which makes it a safe road.
The 400 highways are not set up like the Autobahn nor are they designed like the Autobahn except for the 407. The speed limit on the Autobahn is set for flow and drivers are shown signs as they go.
If you want to speed on an open road, how do you account for a change in road condition? Especially if no one is monitoring the open road ahead?
I don’t have all the answers. Speeding is a decision and it’s a stupid one. I don’t condone it. The 401, 400 and 404 were not built for and cannot handle autobahn speeds. Good luck with that
It’s poor judgement, not speed that kills. If speed, that lurking, evil force that resides in every motor actually did kill, thousands of Germans would be dying daily on the Autobahn. At every MotoGP race the hapless field of eighteen riders would be slaughtered in the first turn.
Gigababy certainly has all the answers, doesnt’ she? I wouldn’t have bothered posting, but her insulting tone and condescending preaching is really annoying. Blaming speed, and not the DECISION to speed is the real problem. Riding at 160 on a deserted road is less risky than sitting at a red light on a busy road.
Norm
I like how you left out “key parts” from the news story.
The initiative by the OPP is part of a national campaign by the federal government to make Canada’s roads the safest in the world by 2010. More than 450 people were killed on Ontario roads last year alone. So, what do you say to the families of those who have been killed? Sorry, but sucks to be you? What if it was your mom, your bro or your wife killed by a motorist speeding excessively? Show me scientific data that speeds above 130 don’t kill. Your attitude is appalling. It’s speeders like you who created this nanny state.
The same day the Province announced introduction of a traffic surveillance plane for the OPP, another report highlighted that Ontario roads are the safest in North America. Those stats would have been gathered before the ‘street racing’ legislation. So the plane will make roads even more safe? Where do we draw the line?
How about mandatory GPS tracking on every vehicle, with speed and location delivered to a central computer in real time? If you’re not breaking the law, why would you worry? The insurance companies are already trying it.
Be afraid. Be very afraid.
5.    Federal Bill C-19, which was developed from Bills C-65 and C-230 which were introduced by Chuck Cadman, was passed in Ottawa Nov 1/06 which defines street racing, and has added various offences such as dangerous driving causing death and bodily harm to the criminal code. This bill was also supported by all parties in the House of Commons. This now the law of the land. It is not a whim of an overzealous politician or police captain. It has been developed over time and debated extensively and passed overwhemingly by your elected representatives.
3.    A driver’s licence and usage of the highways is a privilege, not a constitutional right.  If the trust of privilege is broken, the benefit is taken away. Plain and simple.
4.    If Mr;. Chisholm finds the stunt driving portion of 203 onerous, wait until the full effect of the impaired driving section is enforced.
What Mr. Chisholm and many others fail to recognize
1.    Ontario Bill 203, the Safer Roads for a Safer Ontario Act, 2007 passed with total support from all parties April 24, 207 for enforcement to commence October 1, 2007.  Measures in this law is an update from PMB 122 and section 172 of the Highway Traffic Act.
2.    Measures for immediate vehicle seizure and immediate driver’s license were debated and approved by all, including committees involving politicians, government officials, police, the legal and the private sector.
This petition is not about the validity ot stupidity of how one may or may not drive. No, driving is not a right, it is in fact a privlige. However, the right to be assummed innocent until proven guilty, is.
Seizing your license and your vehicle before actualy proving you’re guilty is clearly a violation of the above mentioned right, which is guarenteed under the charter of rights and freedoms.
This law makes you pay the penalty of something you may never be convicted of before it goes through due process.
This may be the beginning of a very slippery slope, and once it starts…..
You are all MISSING the POINT.
DRIVING is NOT a CIVIL right as outlined in the Canadian Charter of RIGHTS and FREEDOM. What paragraph? Tell me. What section?
Where???
Driving is a privilege. You people are incredibly STUPID.
Its not the speeding portion of the law that is the problem, its the smaller things that can get you the same result… such as a wheel spinning (slight rain too much gas), improper use of a yield intersection, a small wheelie (like when you accidentally drop a gear instead of upshifting while accelerating on a some sport bikes). I support getting the careless dumbasses off our roads, but be careful what you wish for, this law goes too far. Look into the actual wording of the law… http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/about/bill203.htm. Oh and if you are “caught” twice in 10 yrs, 2 yrs in jail!!
Just before the bill became law, I was charged with careless driving because another red sportbike was speeding excessively and doing stunts. I happened to be on the highway at the same time with a red sportbike. I got pulled over and the other rider was too later. I took it to court and had the charges dropped. Under the new law I would have wrongly had my bike taken away and license temporarily suspended. Harsh penalties for racing are fine but let me prove my innocence first.
Can I ask where all of you are rushing to? Why is 120 not fast enough? Why would you want someone in a Vibe doing 150 alongside you, or better yet, a Yaris? What if a tailgate flew off a truck or a deer hops onto the highway? Just you know the faster you go the longer it takes for you to stop? And if you crash, the what? Who pays for your hospital stay? I do. It doesn’t matter how good of a driver you think you are, speed kills. Just a difference of 10k over the limit makes a huge difference when trying to stop or avoid a change in road condition. Man, u r all ignorant pieces of work.
This petition is not about the legality of speeding or getting caught. if you do the crime, you have to pay the fine.
This law’s main flaw is that the police can impose the law without any due process of the courts.
And then the towing company are making money off the backs of people who haven’t been convicted through due process.
In Canada and the US, I would like to believe that your innocent until proven guilty, and since enough people have had the their tickets reduced to 49 over, the courts agree, its too harsh in some cases.
Sorry, http://www.1320movie.com site is not up yet, but heard it will be up by next week. Discusses this phenomenon…
If you are into street racing stuff:
http://www.1320movie.com
My beef with this legislature is that if you are driving fast it doesn’t necessarily mean that you are driving aggresively. You could very easily be doing 20 under the speed limit and still manage to cut off other drivers with every move you make. If you want to fight aggressive drivers pull up to any intersection and watch as people go through it. I can easily exceed the speed limit by 50 and still be in better control of my machine than much slower jackasses with no respect for other drivers.
oh it got interesting all right. pownage of the highest degree.
lulzy at that at her [url=http://gigababy.blogspot.com/2008/05/sign-petition-and-then-what-open-letter.html]website[/url]
I find this petition interesting.
Can you please tell me which MPP you plan on approaching to introduce your petition into the Ontario Legislature and when do you plan to present this petition as [url=http://gigababy.blogspot.com/2008/05/no-harm-done-right-cost-of-collisions.html]I’d like to be there[/url].
The street racing legislation was passed as a tool to help the OPP combat aggressive driving.
I suppose in your mind, you drive perfectly fine and should be “allowed” to drive at whatever speed you are most comfortable with regardless of training, change in road condition or your safety.
wow more than double
your wasting your time
the only ones against this law are the speeders/streetracer
if your doing 50 over you dont deserve to drive get off our roads
Wow!!!
More than double the number from yesterday…